verily i say unto thee today shalt thou be with me in paradise?

Did the Thief on the Cross go to Heaven?

The thief on the cross has many Christians believing that they go straight to heaven when they die. The problem is, they ignore some key important points regarding this issue. So in this Bible study we will look at these points and find out the real Bible truth about what happened to the thief on the cross.
First, let's look at the Bible text itself about Jesus and the thief ... Luke 23:42-43 ...'And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when Thou comest into Thy kingdom. And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with Me in Paradise.' ... So, where is paradise?

Revelation 2:7 ...'To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the Paradise of God.'

Revelation 22:1-2 ...'And he showed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb. In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river was there the tree of life.'

So paradise is where God dwells, which is in the highest heaven. So the question is, did the thief go to paradise with Jesus THAT day as the Bible verse in Luke 23 suggests? And is the thief now dwelling with God in heaven? Well, we know that Christ died on the cross and then was buried in the tomb, but did He rise again THAT same day and go to heaven? Let's take a look:
1 Corinthians 15:3-4 ...'Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures; and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the scriptures.' ... So according to this Bible verse, Christ didn't rise from the dead until the THIRD day after His death on the cross. Do you now see the problem with the statement: "TODAY you will be with Me in paradise"? Well, maybe Christ went to heaven when He died? The answer to that question is found in the next verse:

John 20:17 ...'Jesus saith unto her, Touch Me not; for I am NOT YET ascended to My Father.'

So Jesus had risen from the dead on the third day after His death, and meets Mary and says to her, "I have NOT YET ascended to My Father". So do we have a contradiction with what Jesus said to the thief and what actually happened? We know we cannot question the truthfulness of Christ, because He is without sin and perfect. So we must look for harmony between His statements.
What was really the request of the thief on the cross? ... Luke 23:42 ...'And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into Thy kingdom.' ... Now when did Christ say that He would take His followers to be with Him in His kingdom? ... John 14:2-3 ...'In My Father's house are many mansions, if it were not so I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you, and if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto Myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.' ... Do you see? It is at the second coming that Jesus takes His people to be where He is. If Jesus didn't come back again, then we couldn't be with him, as Jesus confirmed above when He said, "I will come again... SO THAT you can be where I am."
We can also confirm this in the following Bible verse ... 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 ...'For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God; and the dead in Christ shall rise first: then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air; and so shall we ever be with the Lord.' ... We will meet the Lord WHEN HE RETURNS at the second coming in the air, not before. It is also during this time that the thief on the cross will be remembered by the Lord and given a place in His kingdom.
So why Did Christ use the word "today" when saying that the thief on the cross would be with Him in paradise? Well, the original scriptures that were inspired by God did NOT have punctuation marks. They were ADDED by man later on. So could the comma be in the wrong place? Let's take another look at the verse with the comma in another place:

Luke 23:43 ...'And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee today, shalt thou be with Me in Paradise.'

Wow! We now have harmony with what Jesus said to the thief on the cross and what He said to Mary about not yet ascending to paradise. Jesus was basically saying to the thief, "This is what I'm going to CONFIRM TO YOU TODAY, you WILL be with Me in paradise." Do you see this truth? The comma comes after the word today, not before. The inspiration of the scriptures has nothing to do with punctuation marks, they were added by man and should never be used to establish the meaning of scripture. We must use other scripture to interpret scripture. The thief on the cross is not in heaven, he is in his grave awaiting the second coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and the resurrection of the saved. THEN he will be with Jesus in paradise.
If Christians would just understand the Bible teaching of what happens when we die, then there would be no need for confusion over this subject of the thief on the cross. The plain truth is, we return to dust when we die and wait in our graves until the resurrection at the second coming of Christ Jesus. And this is where the thief on the cross is, in his grave (asleep). Awaiting THAT DAY when he will be with Jesus in Paradise.


2nd Comment

Let us read the words of Jesus to the tortured pris-oner at his side once again: “I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in Paradise.” If we look at the comma after “I tell you the truth[,]” there is one thing we may know for sure; this comma was never part of the original text. That text was written without any punctuation, that is, without things such as commas, colons, or periods. Not until centuries later did someone copying the text insert it, as it agreed with his own opinion! Let’s see what happens if we take the liberty of moving the comma a little bit, and from a linguistic point of view, this is both fully possible and fully correct:
“I tell you the truth today, you will be with me in Paradise.”
Suddenly the words of Jesus give a different impression! No longer is he saying when the criminal will be with him in paradise but that he will, and he says it today—today, in the middle of the unbearable pain; to-day, when it looks the darkest; today, facing the inescapable end.
Using the word “today” as an intensifying word was not unusual in Biblical times, as did, for example, Moses: “See, I have set before you today life and good, death and evil, in that I command you today to love the LORD your God…But if your hearts turn away so that you do not hear…I announce to you today that you shall surely perish…I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death.” Deut 30:15-19, NKJV.



3rd Comment

We know from comparing other verses that Jesus did NOT go to "paradise" that very day

The verse as in Luke 23:43, reads: "And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise."

I, and thousands of true Christians KNOW that the comma is in the wrong place,
it should read:"And Jesus said unto him This day , Verily I say unto thee, thou shalt be with me in paradise."

May God bless you as you study His Word

Christian women leaders

There are many Christians that will say that women should not be leaders in the church. It seems that there is a wide range of what the local bodies of believers will allow women to do in the church. In many cases, various scriptures are quoted such as 2 Ti. 2:11-15 and women can do nothing in the church. In others, 1 Co. 1:34 & 35 is quoted and the women are not even allowed to speak. Some local bodies quote Romans 16:1 & 2 and use that scripture to allow women to serve (be a deaconess). In many cases, these same congregations limit the women to certain areas of service.
A closer look at scripture might shed some light on this subject. If we look in Paul's letter to the Galatians, chapter 3 verses 25-28, we see him explaining that we are no longer under the law. Paul explains that, in Christ, we find salvation and that salvation is the same for all. He further explains that, through that salvation, we are all sons of God. If we can agree that all of us receive the same salvation, then we can proceed to look at what that means.
In Acts 2:38 and elsewhere in scripture, we are told that, if we are children of God then we will be given the gift of the Holy Spirit. In 1 Corinthians 12:13, we are told that there is one Spirit and that we are of one body. In Galatians 5:22 & 23, we are given a list of "fruit of the Spirit" so that we are able to tell if someone has that Spirit.
All of this leads to one question and that question, to any congregation, is "who is leading the church?" If you say that God is leading the church, more than likely, you will probably say that God leads the church through the Holy Spirit. If you agree with that, then maybe you will see that, since we already saw how there is only one Spirit and it is given to both male and female, women should be able to have a leadership role in the church. If you do not agree with the statement that God is leading the local church, through the Holy Spirit, then that leads back to our original question. In that case you must admit that it is men leading the church. If that is the case, you must also realize that men can make mistakes but God does not. Usually, when men are in control, that leads to a bunch of rules and those rules can vary and change as needed.
A final thought takes us back to the Old Testament and the book of Judges. In Judges Chapter 4, we see that Deborah was leading Israel. (Some versions use the word judging in place of leading.) It even goes on to say that she held court to settle disputes among the people. We must admit that the Israelites were the chosen people of God. We also see from this scripture that Deborah not only led the people but she did so through a very difficult time. We see that she proclaimed the word of God (in verses 6 & 7) and that she led the people to victory. We further see, at the end of Chapter 5, that under Deborah's leadership, the land had peace for forty years.
Therefore, if a woman could lead Israel, how is it that some can say that women cannot even lead a local congregation of God's people?

Where did Chrst go on death (Hell & Abraham bosom) comments

Small editing took place by blog owner Victor.S

 We see the Lord, in John 3:13 speaking regarding this matter.

He said that no man has ascended into heaven, except the son of man (Himself),  who came down from heaven.


Some believe that when the Lord was resurrected, he took the believers who were being held in Abraham's Bosom and transferred them to heaven. Doctor C.I. Scofield saw in the word that Hades was made up of 2 parts. He shared on this matter of a transfer, but the word DOES NOT support this theory. Hebrew 11:1-16 & 32-40 they with us (the church) cannot be made perfect.

"Paul was caught up into Paradise and heard unspeakable words, which is not lawful for man to utter.
why would he say this if men were in heaven already ?

We also see Peter in the Book of Acts 2:34 declaring " David did not ascend into the heavens" This was spoken of by Peter AFTER the Lord supposedly transferred all the dead saints to heaven, including David.

If  David, A brother who was a man after God's own heart did not ascend to heaven? Why would Peter declare this, so long after the Lord's ascension?

If all the believers in Abraham's Bosom were transferred to heaven when the Lord resurrected them Peter would never say this regarding David?

Also there is just the matter of the "Dead in Christ rising first" in 1 Thess 4:16 when the Lord returns.

" But the Lord Himself will with a shout of and  with the voice of the archangel and the trump of God will DESEND FROM heaven and the dead in Christ WIIL RISE first.

There is a meeting point.. in the "air" of the Descending Christ and the ascending saints who are in Abraham Bosom.

If these dead are in heaven and still not in asleep, then there is no need for them to ascend. They would be there in heaven already.


Upon His resurrection our Lord Jesus saw Mary and spoke with her. Where were these countless ones that He was supposed to be transferring at that time?

He said that to her in John 20:17

" Jesus said to her, touch Me not for I have not yet ascended to My Father, but Go to My brethren  and say unto them I ascend to My Father and your Father and My God and your God"

He was very much alone yet in His resurrection we were all included in Him as His Body. But this does not mean that the saints were transferred to heaven. Peter and Paul indicated this much in their writings.

So dear friends, the dead in Christ are still awaiting the sound of the trump of God inorder to rise. Then we shall meet the Lord in the AIR... notice that the bible does not say "heaven" but "air"

 Other than that, it is unthinkable to believe that there are dead believers lying unclothed ( without their glorified bodies) before God. There is a principle of being "clothed"with the glorified transfigured bodies that most of those who say that there are believers in heaven right now, did not stop to consider. Its improper to be unclothed before God, especially in this spiritual sense.

The Lord needs to present us fully sanctified as seen in 1 Thes 5:23 which says.
"And the God of peace Himself sanctify you wholly and may your spirit and soul and body be PRESENTED COMPLETE, without blame at the COMING of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Our dead sisters and brothers are yet unclothed and are not ready to be presented before God. So we need to stand with the Word and say that the dead believers are still awaiting the resurrection from the dead ( Phil 3:11) Asleep in Abraham Bosom, from where they will be resurrected by the power of God, be transfigured and received their glorified bodies and then taken Glory heaven real paradise With Christ.

Grace be with your spirit ,.
Add
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The visible clouds Sky up in the mountains may be considered the first heaven.

 Where the Sun, Moon and Stars where the second heaven.s  is

The third heaven must be the heaven above the heavens, the hightest heaven as seen in Deut 10:14 and Psa 148:4... where the Lord Jesus and God are today ( Eph 4:10, Hebrews 4:14; 1:3)

 Erika comments

Jesus went to hell to take the keys of death from satan. No, he didn't suffer there. His suffering was done here on earth.
He had sinned, (The Sins of the world were laid on him & he was made a curse for us, my addition added )and God had to punish sin. (OUR DISOBEDIENCE WAS UPON HIM) . Until Jonah had asked for forgiveness and obeyed God-God couldn't bless him.

 All the scriptures are referring to is of God had to punish sin because of Man's disobedience to Him. So, he could not bless them until they had asked Him for forgiveness or obeyed him.

 The only time that God didn't look at his Son, Jesus, was when he had all the sins of man laid on him on the cross. He still loved him most definitely, as he does us when we sin, but he is too Holy to look at sin. Remember when Jesus said, "Father, why have you forsaken me." This is when God turned his head from him because of all the sins of this world resting on Jesus. But, he never suffered when he went to hell to take the keys of death away from satan. See, all this was kept secret from satan. He really thought that Jesus, the Son of God, was a gonna been killed forever and that he could have all the authority here on earth, but he was so wrong. He had not known God's plan. This is so great!

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chapel247 answered 6 years ago

You forgot to mention that HE (JESUS) made a show of the devil openly, and took keys from him before HE rose. This would indicate that HE was in Hell, which makes perfect sense, because HE had to pay that price so you and I wouldn't have to go there ourselves! Remember, HE took on the sins of the whole world! HE became sin, that we might become the righteousness of GOD! It was that sin that required punishment, that freed us from experiencing it. JESUS, before experiencing that separation from HIS Father, said; "If there's any other way, never the less, not my will but thine be done." What happened to JESUS, between HIS death and resurrection, is the eternal separation (Hell), that would have happened to us all.
Thank You JESUS, for paying the price for us!!!

Why it is Important that Jesus Really Rose from the Dead?

Why it is Important that Jesus
Really Rose from the Dead?
-by Tony Warren
    Because if Christ did not rise from the dead, then our faith is in vain, because that means we have not been risen up in Him and are all still dead in our trespass and sins! This is the very basis of Christianity! It is very important for us to understand that the physical resurrection of Jesus Christ is vitally important to Christian theology. If Christ be not risen from the dead, then the dead rise not and our preaching of the resurrection is untrue! Everything of the gospel becomes a lie because it all hangs on the death and resurrection of Christ. 1st Corinthians 15:12-19

• Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?
  
• But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:
  
• And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
  
• Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
  
• For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
  
• And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.
  
• Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
  
• If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.

We read here in these verses seven reasons why the resurrection of Christ is so vital to true Christianity. God makes it clear that if the dead do not rise from the grave, then: 1. "Christ Himself is not risen!" 2. "our preaching of it is empty, and your faith is also empty!" 3. "we are found as false witnesses of God, because we have
    testified that God has raised up Christ from the dead!" 4. "our faith is futile if this is not true!" 5. "We are still in our sins if this is not true!" 6. "Those who have fallen asleep [died] in Christ, have perished!" 7. "If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men the most pitiable!" Without Christ's resurrection, and our own resurrection from the dead in Him, the entire New Testament is without confirmation or validation. Hebrews 9:17

• "For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth".

Christ had to die in order to Confirm or strengthen the Testament with many. Jesus told his Disciples that he was going to die and that he would be resurrected. If only part of this was true (that is, his death), then the faith of every Christian is in vain because Jesus did not tell the truth. That cannot be! His Words are the Word of God and absolutely true and trustworthy! If not, then how are we made righteous by Him? All these things hinge on Christ's death and Resurrection. Jesus promised that those who believed in Him would never die, but have eternal life (-John 3:16). And so if Jesus did not rise from the dead, how then can we believe the promise of eternal life? If Jesus rose not, then what about the testimony? There are only three possible answers.

1. The Apostles lied about it!
2. The apostles were fooled! Or,
3. The Apostles told the Truth!

First of all, the integrity of the Apostles is self evident, they did not lie! Second, they could not have been fooled, as their testimony is that they themselves saw Him, and talked with Him. Third, more than that, there were many witnesses (including Paul) to the risen Christ as Jesus appeared not only to all of the Apostles a number of times, but also to many others. 1st Corinthians 15:4-8

• "And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
  
• And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:
  
• After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.
  
• After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.
  
• And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time."

And so it's clear that the Apostles truly saw Him and talked with Him. And like Christ, the Apostles were hated and reviled and persecuted, and indeed killed for their belief in Jesus. Do you think that men perpetrating a silly fraud would continue to suffer and give their very lives for a lie, or for a resurrection which they were unsure of? It is ridiculous to think so! The very Church began because Jesus's Apostles believed that after his death, he rose from the dead. It is the main point of the gospel preaching. Without Christ's resurrection, all that the Church has to stand upon is a dead man, not a living Saviour! But Praise God, Christ is Risen, and the importance of that resurrection is in us, who have been risen with Him. A Resurrection, without which, we are still dead in sins and are of all men most foolish. Peace,
Copyright ©1998 Tony Warren

Explaination of Christ has firstborn and first begotten

Hebrews 1:6 calls the Son the firstbegotten. This does not mean the Son was the first being created by God or even that He was created, for this same verse indicates that the "begetting" occurred after the creation of the angels. Certainly, the Son is not "eternally begotten" because verse 5 describes the begetting as occurring at a certain point in time: "Thou art my son, this day have I begotten thee." So, in what sense is the Son the "firstbegotten"?

The term has several meanings. In one sense of the word, the Son was not just the first begotten but also the only begotten (John 3:16). That is to say, the Son is the only person literally conceived by the Holy Ghost (God); the virgin birth made it possible for complete deity and complete humanity to unite in one person. Moreover, the Son is the firstbegotten in the sense that He was planned in the mind of God before anything else. Furthermore, the Son is the firstbegotten in that He was the first to conquer sin and death. He is "the first-begotten of the dead" (Revelation 1:5), "the firstborn among many brethren" (Romans 8:29), and "the firstborn from the dead" (Colossians 1:18). All these verses of Scripture use the same Greek word, prototokos, as in Hebrews 1:6. Christ was the firstfruits of the resurrection since He was the first to be bodily resurrected and given a glorified body (I Corinthians 15:20).

Since Jesus Christ is the head of the church, which is called the "church of [belonging to] the firstborn" (Hebrews 12:23), we can interpret the designation of Christ as "the firstborn [prototokos] of every creature" in Colossians 1:15 to mean the firstborn of the spiritual family of God that is called out of all creation. Through faith in Him we can become sons and daughters of God by the new birth (Romans 8:14-17). Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith (Hebrews 12:2), the captain of our salvation (Hebrews 2:10), the apostle and high priest of our profession (Hebrews 3:1), and our brother (Hebrews 2:11-12). It is in His redemptive role that He can be called the firstbegotten or firstborn among many brethren.

Christ's title as firstborn has significance not only in the sense of first in order but also first in power, authority, and pre-eminence, just as the eldest brother has pre-eminence among his brothers. As applied to Christ, firstborn does not mean He was the first man physically born, but that He is first in power. This is the primary meaning of Colossians 1:15 when it says He is "the firstborn of every creature," as we see from subsequent verses. Verses 16-18 describe Jesus as the creator of all things, the head of all power, and the head of the church. In particular, verse 18 says He is "the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the pre-eminence."